4:3 or 16:9

[THRobinson]

Been designing a cabinet for an arcade machine, still on the fence between RaspPi or LaunchBox... though finally getting some success getting LaunchBox working how I want on my PC... still sorting out some MAME and PS2 stuff though. Main debate is between ease of setup and cost.

Either way, I need a monitor. Looking at used ones and was pretty gung-ho about a 22-24" Widescreen, but so far the games tested seem to be all 4:3 (makes sense given the age) and a 19" 4:3 monitor is the same height as a 16:9 23"... but of course, way way cheaper ($15CAD vs $80CAD).

For those who have built cabinets... which way did you go? Widescreen? or the older 4:3? I would like to get the machine working with more modern MAME games and PS2 games... not sure if there are many games that 'need' widescreen.

PS2 being 17yrs old, I assume many (all) games are 4:3.

The MAME games I've gotten to work so far are pre-'95 games (all 4:3) but something like "Marvel vs Capcom 2" I can't get past the "loading" screen to know what aspect ratio it is. I don't think I'll have a lot of modern arcade games, haven't been to an arcade in over 10yrs so no idea what's out there, but definitely X-men and Streetfighter games.

Too bad no vote feature on here... but anyways, just hoping for some feedback/insight. Thanks

[neil9000]

Well i haven't built or own a cabinet so take this with a pinch of salt......You are correct in saying that most stuff is 4:3 in fact with a lot of mame games are even narrower than that. Most ps2 games are also 4:3 some offer a widescreen option in the options (god of war does for example) but most of those are not real widescreen as they just letterbox the image top and bottom to make it a 16:9 ratio image. You can with the ps2 emulator though "force" every game to be 16:9 even if they are not supposed to be by design, so you need to decide if that is something you want to do (not every game can be stretched and it causes emulation issues). My advice would be if you plan on playing actual PC games on this cab then get a 16:9, but if it is just for emulation then 4:3 would be best as 99% of games are that aspect ratio or less. Not forgetting of course as you said 4:3 is way cheaper. 

Hope that helps.

[THRobinson]

I noticed that a few games were tall... was almost debating a widescreen and rotating it 90 degrees... I think some games like Pac-man were tall screens. But I think it would be the same as 16:9... such a low % of games would use it.

God of War I managed to get working on my PC, just randomly played with screen settings and managed to get nice smooth graphics, but everything seemed slightly stretched and lots of the bad guys and interactive objects had a weird neon green glow/outline. I;ve since wiped out LaunchBox and RetroArch and started over again, haven't tackled PS2 yet but will try running 4:3 and see if helps.

PC games... most games I play are BioShock, Borderlands and World of Warcraft... although I plan to have a pull out drawer for a keyboard to sit on, I can't see using an arcade machine to play games like those, especially Warcraft. Plus, my personal PC will be much better/more powerful so likely just use it for PC games.

That's my thinking as well... 95+% of the games will be 4:3, plus it means a slightly narrower cabinet. I want to design something similar to classic arcades, but also slim and close to the wall because of space. I also don't want eyes like a pug... seen a few cabinets with 32" screens and look cool... from 10' away. From 2', that's gotta be hard on the eyes.

Local guy (sorta local, I'm middle of nowhere so, 45min away is local) has an HP L1950g for $15CAD... 1280x1024, 5:4 (not 4:3), 5ms, 75hz, 800:1... spec wise, seems fine. Has DVI as well.

Edited May 17, 2017 by THRobinson

[neil9000]

Yeah the god of war "glow/sort of two Kratos" is a thing, sorry forgive me but i think its you i had this conversation with before right about specs for a build? Anyway there are ways to fix that game but its very specific and is exclusively for that game, thats why ps2 is a bit of a weird one to emulate lots of games need game specific tweaks to work correctly. Anyway back to the monitor, Yeah a lot of arcade were simply that, a crt on its side in the cabinet, a lot of vertical shooters did this thats why some games are even norrower than 4:3. Also we haven't talked resolution, if you are just going to use it for emulation you might even only want or need a 720p screen as all the games you want to emulate are much lower than that anyway, and will be easier to upscale to 720p than 1080p.

[THRobinson]

Yup, I had that other thread looking for general feedback because debating between RetroPie and LaunchBox.

Both have upsides and downsides... though, these are based on my limited experience with emulators. Though I'm sure a lot of newbies in my same situation.

If I go LaunchBox, the cost goes up quite a bit from my $60CAD RaspPi to around a $300CAD used computer because as per the other thread, I'd be after a 3rd gen i5. Though, may be worth it simply because of the more modern games option, and LaunchBox is Windows based. I know Windows, I understand Windows... Linux frustrates me every time I have to deal with it.  Because of that... despite extra cost, I am leaning towards the LaunchBox option. I will design the cabinet to hold a full motherboard and powersupply though, then regardless which way I go, it's future-proofed.

RaspPi I may use for my original plan, make a game console. Then just buy those USB SNES controllers off eBay for $5 each.

But ya... was me about specs... if I get a PC it'll be a 3rd Gen i5, 8GB ram, and either my GTX650tiOC card, or if the system comes with something better, that.

Monitors so far (for sale locally) seem to be 1280x1024 5:4... I'm ignoring all monitors that don't have DVI/HDMI and response rates slower than 5ms. I don't want ghosting, or the added cost of an analog/digital converter.

Edited May 17, 2017 by THRobinson

[neil9000]

OK cool, you will have to forgive me i reply to so many issues/queries on here that its often hard to remember who said what where and when, although i was right this time so woo hoo!!!  

Yeah of course a Windows system will always be more expensive than a retropie setup, at the end of the day you are buying a full PC vs a cheap single chip board that to be fair is very under powered. And before anyone says i am biased i have a raspberry pi 2, and bought the original pi as soon as it was released so i have experience on both sides. I remember when retropie first got released it was still a nightmare to setup right, its much better now though. Also retropie is not the only choice Lakka is great also, if you dont know it is basically straight up Retroarch, same ui and cores excluding the windows cores of course. Retropie/lakka only goes to at a stretch ps1 though, and to be fair thats not great, and N64 is piss poor as well. so if you want full emulator support Windows is really the only solution.

[THRobinson]

No worries... I remember conversations and avatars no problem, but names, I can't remember at all.

I noticed that about N64 on the Pi... I never played an N64 (discovered women when that came out so gaming days were back-burnered for a while) but wasn't impressed. PSOne, was ok, not great either for the Spyro and MediEvil series... which I have to have because the nieces/nephews loved those games.

How are the games like on an arcade build for stuff like God of War anyways? Now that controllers have those dual thumb knobs... will I be stuck needing a PS2 style controller to play PS2 games?

I got a few of these off eBay for my original build idea, may put a pair under the monitor for connecting stuff like controllers and keyboards... though rather play an arcade machine like an arcade machine, not standing there with a PS2/3 controller in my hand.

[neil9000]

Well that is a issue you are gonna have, how authentic do you want your "Arcade Cab" to be? Just Arcade games or Console games as well, and if you want to play said God of War then you obviously need a duel stick game pad as well, which takes away from the "Cab" part of the build as you will need console controllers connected as well.

[THRobinson]

Ya... though decisions like that are for both RaspPi and LaunchBox... though less with RaspPi becuase no PS2 games just PSOne.

USB ports it is.

...and a 4:3 or 5:4 monitor. As cool/flashy as a big 24" Widescreen would look, I suspect I'd be looking at black bars on either side 99% of the time.

 

Thanks

[neil9000]

1 minute ago, THRobinson said:

...and a 4:3 or 5:4 monitor. As cool/flashy as a big 24" Widescreen would look, I suspect I'd be looking at black bars on either side 99% of the time.

Yep.

 

[neil9000]

25 minutes ago, THRobinson said:

I noticed that about N64 on the Pi... I never played an N64 (discovered women when that came out so gaming days were back-burnered for a while)

Lol, i was about 18-19 when that came out, so i was already well aware of woman, and they had to be player two on Mario Kart, and there were rules and such for the loser, although im not going into what that involved on here!!!  

[THRobinson]

18 minutes ago, neil9000 said:

Lol, i was about 18-19 when that came out, so i was already well aware of woman, and they had to be player two on Mario Kart, and there were rules and such for the loser, although im not going into what that involved on here!!!  

I should clarify... I knew about women, I just had no luck gettin' any until I then.

Now it seems the other way around... I see stuff online about female gamers and comicon stuff and think... dammit... why wasn't it that way in the early '90s? I got stuck in highschool when grunge and depression were the 'in' thing.

[neil9000]

Just now, THRobinson said:

Now it seems the other way around... I see stuff online about female gamers and comicon stuff and think... dammit... why wasn't it that way in the early '90s? I got stuck in highschool when grunge and depression were the 'in' thing.

Couldn't agree any more........

[neil9000]

Just now, neil9000 said:

Couldn't agree any more........

But you make those old freinds, for life. And then everyone you meet after needs to now games!!

[SentaiBrad]

Personally, I would prefer 16:9. If the vertical size of a 4:3 screen is about the same as a 16:9, any vertical games are going to be about the same size, just more will be black on the sides. If you're wanting to run a lot of newer games though, forcing 16:9 in to a 4:3 is much worse to me than forcing a 4:3 in to a 16:9. With 4:3 on a 16:9, you're not losing any size (unless the screen is much smaller obviously). In a 16:9 on 4:3 scenario, you're going to lose some size, and I think that looks worse. Not every PS2 game offers 16:9 obviously, but quite a lot do, or have Widescreen patches / hacks readily available if you really wanted them.

[THRobinson]

For the PS2 games going 16:9... is it adding more to the sides to make it wider? or is it chopping off some of the image at the top/bottom to make it 16:9?

If it's adding, then I'll have to ponder a bit more, but if it simply cropping off the top/bottom then I'd rather stick with 4:3 in case I'm missing stuff.

[SentaiBrad]

It wont crop, it just forces the 16:9 image in to the 4:3 screen, meaning there are massive black bars on the top and bottom, and it makes the image much smaller.

[THRobinson]

8 minutes ago, SentaiBrad said:

It wont crop, it just forces the 16:9 image in to the 4:3 screen, meaning there are massive black bars on the top and bottom, and it makes the image much smaller.

I'm talking the other way around... a PS2 game that's normally 4:3 being displayed widescreen 16:9... is it stretched and distorted? is more added to the left/right to make it widescreen? or is it cropping the top/bottom of the 4:3 to make it 16:9?

[SentaiBrad]

So it depends. There is a way to force it, never force it. Some games are built for 16:9 as well. For the games where you can put in a code to do it, the Widescreen Hacks as it were, it's actually done very very well. The PCSX2 website showcases a lot of them. There's a thread over there all about it, so check it out to see how it looks. It's not doing any cropping as far as I know; It's actually just widening the screen. Obviously this wont work for all games, some would be glitched, but yea.